Minister of Foreign Affairs Nikos Dendias’ interview with “SKAI” TV’s prime-time newscast and journalist Sia Kossioni (23.02.2023)

JOURNALIST: At this point, let us welcome Minister of Foreign Affairs, Nikos Dendias to SKAI TV’s prime-time newscast. Minister, good evening and get well soon. I hope you are well.

N. DENDIAS: I am considerably better, thank you very much.

JOURNALIST: Your illness occurred at a difficult time, considering that you were expected to live up to a substantive, but also highly symbolic visit by the US Secretary of State, Antony Blinken. What came out was a very warm atmosphere; tell us though, if this visit met your expectations.

N. DENDIAS: First of all, as you rightly point out, I would have preferred this visit to have taken place without me having a fever of 39.5C. Yet, the visit was excellent in the sense that the American side articulated, both publicly and in private talks, exactly what we expected. That is, the recognition of Greece’s role as a pillar of stability in the region. A firm pillar for peace, International Law, and the Law of the Sea, as well as for everything we stand for in our foreign policy.
JOURNALIST: Minister, has Washington voiced any concern over the next day of Greek-Turkish relations? And I’m asking this as Mr. Blinken’s trip to Ankara as well as his contacts with your counterpart and also with the Turkish president preceded his visit to Athens. I’m wondering if he somehow delivered a message from our neighboring country.

N. DENDIAS: The truth is that he didn’t have to because we had recently spoken with Mevlüt Çavuşoğlu at length. But the US side saw this possibility of resuming talks with Türkiye very positively and, of course, encouraged us in every possible way in that direction. But, that’s it. Let no one assume – because I have seen various reports- that the US side went into detail about what we’ll do, how we’ll do it, what we’ll say, when we’ll say it, on what grounds, etc. There was no such thing.

JOURNALIST: So, there wasn’t. A few days ago, you met with your counterpart while traveling to the affected areas in Türkiye; you also had these important meetings with the U.S. Secretary of State. Considering the new circumstances, what is the next day in Greek-Turkish relations? Are we ready for both sides to return to the dialogue table with more calm?

N. DENDIAS: First of all, as I have always stated, and you will allow me to reiterate, the assistance that we are providing and will continue to provide, either bilaterally or as an EU member state, to the Turkish people and Turkish society that have been affected by these horrific, devastating earthquakes, as well as to Syrian society in any way we can, has nothing to do with the broader Greek foreign policy. We are not negotiating this; we are not asking for some geopolitical quid pro quo. This is our human duty.

JOURNALIST: I’m sure you are not, but there’s always the expectation that this so-called “earthquake diplomacy” will work.

N. DENDIAS: Let me explain. I believe the average Greek is happy about that. He is happy to assist his fellow human beings in times of need. Aside from that, of course, a different climate has emerged. And in a different climate, a very positive climate of re-engagement between societies, it is very easy to pursue a foreign policy of re-engagement and resumption of discussions. This is so. Yet we must not forget that both countries are about to hold elections. This is generally not encouraging for major moves. What could be possibly done is some reopening of discussions on Confidence Building Measures or perhaps a resumption of exploratory talks.

Yet again, I reiterate that both countries are in the run-up to elections. What is needed right now is to protect with great care this highly improved climate that exists. I’d like to note in a very positive way, that Turkish violations in the Aegean airspace have been drastically reduced, if not reduced to zero. I believe, therefore, that a climate has been created on both sides, ours and Türkiye’s, which allows or will allow a resumption of talks. And right now, the main task for me is not to find solutions that… (journalist’s intervention) … but to preserve this climate.

JOURNALIST: Maintaining this calm. So, I take you to be suggesting that it is the new governments that will emerge from the upcoming elections in both countries that will delve into our issues. But I’d like your assessment on whether Türkiye will be a different country the next day as this is something that is very much debated, not only within the country but also among international analysts. And in this regard, whether it will be a different country in terms of the issue we are concerned about, the issue of provocative conduct, expansionism, extreme rhetoric that it employs against our country.

N. DENDIAS: I don’t want to reopen old wounds by recalling past practices that have really harmed our relations. And I believe we are all aware of that. I want to focus on the positive side: that there is an excellent climate right now. In this climate, I believe that uniform approaches to extremely difficult issues could be built.

But we’ll have to wait and see. Because we have a clear understanding of the situation. We cannot expect things to change instantly from black to white or from red to yellow by tomorrow morning. We’ll see. Yet, it is worth preserving the current climate and giving diplomacy a chance. This is what I am trying and will try to do up until the elections.

JOURNALIST: That goes without saying. What I’m trying to figure out though, is whether there is an overly optimistic perception at this stage that tomorrow morning Ankara may forget, say, the narrative about the demilitarization of our islands. I’d like to know whether there is such an expectation, such hope.

N. DENDIAS: If you are asking me whether I believe that the Greek-Turkish dispute is solvable, the answer is it most certainly is. This is what I believe, what I have believed since the beginning, what I have supported, and what I will continue to support. That means, of course, that we must agree on a solid basis. What is the solid basis? The International Law and the International Law of the Sea. I am not telling you anything different from what I would have told you a month ago, two or three months ago. So, I believe that on this basis, in this climate, a solution can be found. A solution to the Greek-Turkish dispute can be found, from which both Greece and Turkey can benefit. Because one’s gain is not another’s loss. These are things I deeply believe in and have always believed in. And I believe that in a good climate, with a friendly country rather than a country that threatens you, all this can be implemented. But that remains to be proven, because, as the saying goes, “it takes two to tango.” It doesn’t mean anything just because I say it.

JOURNALIST: Certainly. There’s, however, a move on the part of Türkiye. On the same day that Antony Blinken was there, it was announced by your Turkish counterpart that the country is returning to the table of dialogue with Sweden regarding the latter’s accession to NATO. How do you assess this move?

N. DENDIAS: Absolutely positive. I believe Türkiye should ratify the agreement for both Sweden and Finland. I think this is in Türkiye’s best interest. I understand that Türkiye is also in the run-up to elections, that there are issues, and so on. But I believe it’s wrong to exclude countries like Sweden or Finland from NATO membership. Of course, I’m not the one to point out to the Turkish leadership what is in their country’s best interest, perish the thought. I’m just saying that if I were in that position, I would make a different decision. And I’m really glad that Türkiye is heading towards a possible resolution. I’m referring now to the two countries’ accession to NATO.

JOURNALIST: Might I presume, based on the climate you’re describing, that the concerns or any concerns that may have existed in the past about a “hot incident”, an escalation of Turkish aggression in the Aegean in the run-up to elections no longer exist?

N. DENDIAS: First of all, I never believed Türkiye would attempt anything. Yet, what I feared and had previously stated is an accidental incident that would get out of hand due to the current circumstances. I think this possibility is dramatically reduced, if not entirely eliminated, under the excellent climate prevailing at the moment.

JOURNALIST: One last point. Minister, tomorrow marks one year since the Russian invasion of Ukraine. I’d like your assessment of whether this war will last much longer as well as a more specific answer from you regarding Greece’s commitments to Ukraine. And whether anything has been requested by the U.S. Secretary of State in this regard.

N. DENDIAS: Of course, it is tragic. A horrible year-long war, may I say, a completely useless war. A huge Russian mistake, a massive violation of International Law, and a barbaric invasion of an independent country. Nobody expected to experience such things in Europe in the 21st century. But we did.

Now, do I see an easy resolution? Not at all. But as I have repeatedly said in public, for me, for Greek foreign policy, for the Mitsotakis government, and, I believe, for the vast majority of Greek society, there is black and white. There is right and wrong. Just as we have stated that our basis is International Law and International Law of the Sea, it is this International Law that governs our choice of support for Ukraine. What we believe for ourselves, is precisely what we are applying as regards Ukraine. So, we have no other choice.

We will continue to support a country that seeks the implementation of the United Nations Charter and defends its independence with its citizens’ blood. That’s our position.

JOURNALIST: Are there any additional things that have been asked of us?

N. DENDIAS: In addition to what we are already doing? No. The US side is interested in us remaining firm in our support for the Ukrainian cause. Yet, to tell you the truth, we didn’t need, we don’t need to be asked that by the US side. We don’t do it as a favor to the US; we do it because these are our principles. It’s our decision what we support, because this is what we stand for in our own affairs.

JOURNALIST: Indeed. Mr. Dendias, I’d like to thank you very much for the discussion we had. Have a good night.

N. DENDIAS: Thank you very much.