Minister of Foreign Affairs Nikos Dendias’ interview with “ALPHA RADIO 9,89 FM” and journalists Nikos Panagiotopoulos and Dina Moschou- highlights (09.05.2023)

N. PANAGIOTOPOULOS: As we’ve already announced, let us welcome our next guest. It’s the Minister of Foreign Affairs, Mr. Nikos Dendias. Let us welcome him.

D. MOSCHOU: Minister, good afternoon.

N. DENDIAS: Good afternoon, Ms. Moschou, Mr. Panagiotopoulos. All the best.

D. MOSCHOU: We wish you good luck and strength.

N. DENDIAS: Thank you very much.

N. PANAGIOTOPOULOS: Mr. Dendias, let me begin with a personal question. What’s it like for a man traveling so many miles? You must have broken some sort of record, right? I don’t know if you’ve counted the miles and the countries.

N. DENDIAS: Actually, I have. I have exceeded 1,100,000 miles.

D. MOSCHOU: You’re kidding me!

N. DENDIAS: About twice as far to the moon and back. And a little farther, I believe.

D. MOSCHOU: Please, tell us also the flight hours you have.

N. DENDIAS: Just divide that by 600 which is the average plane speed.

N. PANAGIOTOPOULOS: You’ve been around the world. Actually, as Foreign Minister, you’ve visited countries that the Minister of Foreign Affairs of Greece had never visited before.

N. DENDIAS: 16 of them…

D. MOSCHOU: Our most traveled Foreign Minister in history.

N. PANAGIOTOPOULOS: And of course, this is not a fetish; allow me to use a political slang term frequently used for the euro. It’s a job that actually broadens the horizons and the relations of our country.

N. DENDIAS: But you’re absolutely right. There’s no other way, Mr. Panagiotopoulos. First of all, we are running three campaigns at the United Nations that have never been run before.

N. PANAGIOTOPOULOS: That’s very important for our country.

N. DENDIAS: As regards the one for the Security Council, we’re very close to achieving our goal.

But aside from that, as a medium-sized country, we need understandings, friendships, and alliances. Well, this cannot be accomplished by sitting in Athens and waiting for people to visit you. If we were the United States, we could do that. They would all come running to us.  Now, it’s us that we have to go and explain…
And that’s absolutely necessary, not only because it has occurred but also because it must continue.

D. MOSCHOU: So, the Foreign Minister should be there in person to explain the country’s positions.

N. DENDIAS: There’s a saying, actually a joke: what’s the difference between God and a good Foreign Minister? That God is everywhere, while a good Foreign Minister is everywhere except in his own country.

N. PANAGIOTOPOULOS: That’s right. But as you pass the ball to me, let me ask you a question. What’s it like for a candidate like you, who lives the problems within the country but also sees them from outside, who is constantly traveling and now has to campaign on everyday problems? That is, how close are you to ordinary citizens’ lives?

N. DENDIAS: Look, let’s not kid ourselves; it’s a disadvantage. First of all, there’s the long absence; I have been working 4-5 days a week elsewhere. As a result, that creates a feeling of absence, which I have to make up for during the election campaign. But at the same time, I have to go on with my duties, since say, tomorrow or the day after tomorrow, I have to travel to Stockholm for the Informal meeting Gymnich.

The country cannot be without representation in the Councils because there is an election process.  So, that means that even with this limited time, some of it must be dedicated to serving our national needs.

But what should I do? Look, that’s the job; do it the best you can and society will judge you.

N. PANAGIOTOPOULOS: Has the election race changed as you’re viewing it?  Do people appear to be a little more distant?  Is it becoming a little bit more televised?

N. DENDIAS: Let me tell you this: in general, people are not interested in politics much; that’s the truth.  But I also want to add that as regards the portfolio I’ve had the honor to hold, people value what this government has contributed.

In other words, I dare say that the acceptance rate of the work done in our foreign policy significantly outweighs our own electoral impact. And that, of course, is reflected in my contact with the people I talk to and communicate with.

I believe that the vast majority of them understand what has been achieved.

N. PANAGIOTOPOULOS: We have elections here, elections in Türkiye as well. Let’s turn to serious issues.  Does Nikos Dendias have a preference for who will win the elections in Türkiye?

N. DENDIAS: Of course, Nikos Dendias has a preference, but the Foreign Minister of Greece does not.

N. PANAGIOTOPOULOS: So, since you are the Foreign Minister, it will be difficult for me to make you reveal your personal preference. So let me address the Foreign Minister now.

N. DENDIAS: Yes, it’s absolutely impossible; As Foreign Minister, I’m not entitled to have an opinion.

N. PANAGIOTOPOULOS: I see. So, what should we anticipate from this election, and what can change? There was an improvement in the climate because of the earthquakes, yet we observe…

N. DENDIAS: Significant improvement.

D. MOSCHOU: But Minister, it’s not sustained.

N. DENDIAS: It does not mean that we are complacent, or naive, or that we are pursuing a policy of appeasement.

It does mean though that we have a responsibility to keep a window of opportunity open for the next Greek Government -which we believe will be us- and for the next Turkish Government to be elected by Turkish people, to try, perhaps with a fresher approach, to resolve our dispute.

Now from there on, we will see; there’s enough time ahead. But if we can keep this climate, I believe it will be a huge success. I recall that a few months ago, there was great concern about me and Nikos Panagiotopoulos-who has the same name and surname as you- remaining in our ministries (during the election season) because we were at risk of a crisis with Türkiye at any moment.

So, I believe that having reached this point at this moment is a very positive thing.

N. PANAGIOTOPOULOS: Is there a key to unlocking relations of unity? We all realize, and, those of us who have friends or know, see, and talk to people, businessmen, and workers on the opposite side, that they want cooperation, as well.  Because we all -Turks as well- realize that a Greece and a Türkiye with a relationship of peace at a level of development in tourism and at other levels, for the environment, even in terms of industry, transport -there are so many areas that we can cooperate-, would be very good for both countries.

N. DENDIAS: It would be incredible; it would be an explosion of positive possibilities. But that requires Ankara and the government that will emerge there, to take a realistic approach to our dispute.

If it takes an approach of expansionism and supremacy in the wider region, then Greece certainly cannot agree. If it is an approach within the framework of International Law, that is something completely different and there is ample room for resolving our dispute.

I deeply believe that we are not doomed to be in a relationship of rivalry with Türkiye. On the contrary, I believe that it is simpler to be in a relationship of common understanding on the basis of International Law. But as they say, it takes two to tango; one alone is rather a cacophony.

D. MOSCHOU: Minister, I’m sure you have looked into President Erdogan’s opponents, who appear to have a chance of ousting Erdogan from power, at least according to the foreign media. Will they change their foreign policy and tactics towards our country? What estimations are there?

N. DENDIAS: Based on opinion polls, the chances look pretty good. I can’t tell what the real chances are though.  I’m not sure how opinion polls can be conducted in Turkish society, especially given its interesting geography and its remote parts. So, I’m not sure how reliable the opinion polls can be.

Furthermore, I haven’t heard much from the Turkish opposition to suggest that they are willing to pursue a different approach.

But we should not take what is said in election periods seriously, or, to put it another way, we should not take everything at face value, especially in such a tense election. The opposition may have a more serious view behind what we hear and see.

Nevertheless, it is a coalition of six parties, not one, which means that moving to realistic positions will be tough. And secondly, Hellenism has had a strange experience, not to say a bad experience, with Mr. Kılıçdaroğlu’s party, starting with the invasion of Cyprus.

N. PANAGIOTOPOULOS: To conclude with Greek-Turkish relations and move on to our own elections, do you believe that the energy issue is the sole key to Greek-Turkish relations? Or, to revert it a little bit, if we had a solution, could energy issues bring us closer together? Or are there additional issues as well?

N. DENDIAS: There aren’t many issues concerning energy. And there aren’t many issues to be resolved for one main reason, although that’s where many others started.

D. MOSCHOU: Let us stick for a while to issues related to the Ministry of Foreign Affairs. I’d like to ask for your comment on the ongoing war in Ukraine, Minister. Because Nikos and I were saying, or at least the analysts were saying, the initial predictions were that it would last just a few days and then be over. A year has passed though, and Putin continues to escalate.

N. PANAGIOTOPOULOS. And as we celebrate Victory Day today, I recall that in the past when Russia was very close to the West, European leaders would travel to Moscow, to celebrate the victory against Nazism together.

N. DENDIAS: Nobody disputes the then Soviet Union’s contribution to end the war and victory against Nazism. No one denies that the Soviet Union, that is to say, Russia to a large extent, sacrificed millions of victims in the fight against Nazism.

This has been recognized, as has the enormous contribution to literature, poetry, and music. Everything is there.

But there’s also the brutal invasion of Ukraine. The Russian side may have thought that it would be able to overthrow the Zelenskyy Government within three or four days and install another government in Kyiv, but all this demonstrates that it’s easy to start wars, but difficult to end them.

Currently, the war resulting from the Russian invasion of Ukraine is a tremendous loss and disaster for humanity, but we can do nothing else but uphold International Law and the principles and values that we invoke for ourselves.

And let’s hope for the best and believe that the invader eventually will take a more realistic approach.